Rights of a father without joint custody?

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Re: Rights of a father without joint custody?

Postby Fatheroffour » Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:47 pm

I believe the vast majority of women claining abuse are FOS, your sweetie doesn't have police reports or pictures of bruises and you are in full white knight mode.

That's what I believe.
Everyone lies.
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Re: Rights of a father without joint custody?

Postby Fatheroffour » Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:51 pm

"Choose to be a criminal",,,

Tell me about how you choose to never break a law.

Ever.

Everyone is a criminal by definition.
Everyone lies.
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Re: Rights of a father without joint custody?

Postby jumbledone » Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:06 pm

Fatheroffour wrote:
Everyone is a criminal by definition.


Michael Jackson wrote a song about me, then.
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Re: Rights of a father without joint custody?

Postby Limbo Larry » Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:46 am

Fatheroffour wrote:I believe the vast majority of women claining abuse are FOS, your sweetie doesn't have police reports or pictures of bruises and you are in full white knight mode.

That's what I believe.


You don't see men out there that abuse their women? It's actually fairly common. She was mentally abused by being threatened and then when she was 7 months pregnant he got physical. The next day when he left the house she hopped a plane out of the state and moved in with her aunt to have the baby. I only defend my woman because she is in the right, if she was in the wrong, she wouldn't be my woman.
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Re: Rights of a father without joint custody?

Postby Limbo Larry » Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:47 am

Fatheroffour wrote:"Choose to be a criminal",,,

Tell me about how you choose to never break a law.

Ever.

Everyone is a criminal by definition.


I'm talking serious issues, not speeding tickets or bar fights. I take abuse very seriously, especially to a pregnant woman.
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Re: Rights of a father without joint custody?

Postby Limbo Larry » Sat Feb 04, 2012 2:12 am

Trevor wrote:1. I inferred that she trusts him more than you do because she is doing things to foster the relationship with her daughter and her Dad than you are. But I could be misreading that.

2. The fact that you think he is a criminal, entitled, clueless on being a father, violent, has an illegal job, etc., flies in the face of the mother's conscious choice to encourage more time with the child. If he was such a bad egg, why would the mother do what she is doing? To get the kid out of the picture for a few days here and there so she can spend more time with you? She clearly thinks it's safe. How long ago was the bed incident anyway? Not condoning of course, I am clear on my opinion about violence and abuse...but the mother thinks little of his "violent tendencies," or she'd act differently.

3. Read my posts again and please quote where I said "he's right." I was screwed, sure, but I am not against all mothers because of the poison spewed by one. Nor am I so stupid to think that all fathers are decent ones. But I have to say, it just seems like you are trying to set things up so that when you marry this girl, your life will be less complicated, maybe the 3.5 hour commutes will stop, something like that. It seems you are not so concerned about how the child is doing (can't recall you mentioning it at all) when she sees her Daddy, except that his (illegal) work schedule is erratic and he might not exercise all of his scheduled time. So no, I am not blindly endorsing the Dad, just trying to suss out your strong objection (to say nothing of your sharp defensiveness) and the mother's divergent actions in comparison.

4. You skirted the issue of son/brother but you're not off that hook. If you compare apples:apples and plug in your son or brother, ceteris paribus, would you, larry, push as hard to cut the father out of custodial rights as you are doing with your arguments against this guy? Y/N

5. I am all for helping a parent retain or increase his/her parenting time as long as that person is being a loving and attentive parent to that child, and not being destructive against the other parent in the child's eyes. I think you are conflating (unfairly?) this guy's lousy record of being a spouse with his ability and RIGHTS to be a parent to HIS child. I think I have some good points, but you are right that I don't know the guy. I can only use my brain and experience and YOUR words.

6. I am okay with you calling BS on me, but I maintain my arguments and up the ante. Maybe you really know a lot of stuff that he does to hurt the child but haven't mentioned it. But if you are saying that every man who has made mistakes and/or committed crimes in his life should lose parenting rights because of it, I think that's rubbish. I think it is possible for a criminal to be a great father, as long as he does not teach the child to become a criminal.


1. She reluctantly gives him the time, because other than minor stuff he hasn't put her in danger. I support her decision and sometimes I drive her daughter down to his house so they can spend time together when she is working the weekends. She isn't my bio daughter, but she is a daughter to me, and I follow my fiance's lead. However, if she is wrong I tell her so. We have that type of relationship where we appreciate each other's feedback.

2. His "problems" have not impacted the daughter negatively in a big way as of yet. I already told you about all the girlfriends that he parades in and out of her life, which while annoying, isn't the end of the world. Here is another example....His mother is from Scotland and only sees her grandchild because my fiance has maintained that relationship. The father has cut off his own mother. My fiance has taken her daughter to Scotland twice just so the grandmother can see her. Last year the grandmother came to visit and stayed with my finance, everything was great for a few days. The grandmother attempted to reconcile her relationship with her son and after spending one night there, the three of them, she somehow ended up on a plane back to Scotland 8 days early. He drove her out of the country because they had a fight. His daughter lost out on time with her grandmother that she sees once per year.

How can you assume that my finance lets him have time so we can spend alone time together? She has done everything she can to keep their relationship in tact and is often met with anger if she is 5 minutes late dropping her off. he has not idea what she does for him, it's like his daughter magicially appears at the start of their parenting time and magically gets picked up when it's over. he doesn't comprehend all the driving she does. And don't even get me started on the BS W2 he has on record where he makes 28K per year, while he lives large because all his money is under the table cash.

3. I have no objection to him getting as much parenting time as he wants or can handle. I never said I want him cut out of the picture. All I said is that my fiance doesn't trust him to have decision making abilities. She gives him as much time as he wants pretty much. He sees her every weekend. he would have full weekend overnights every other weekend, but he can't take her that much. the other weekend he still sees her all day either on sat or sun. And again, I said when we move, my fiance will continue to drive her down to him every weekend and nothing will change. I'm defensive because I presented the facts and sought help and instead i'm getting attacked saying her story is probably BS, he deserves the time, etc. You don't know the guy like I do. If he came here, you can help him all you want, but he won't come here.

As far as the daughter is concerned, she loves her father. She is completely insulated on our side from what her father is and what he has done. We praise him to her and do everything we can to facilitate that relationship, just like we do with my son and his mother. The daughter and myself have an amazing relationship which has no bearing on what I was asking for of the forum. She is also a sister to my son. They know each other since before they turned 2 and do everything together.

4. Like I said, if my son or brother acted like him he would get a kick in the asss. If you do certain things it shows you shouldn't have the rights that others have. He hasn't missed out on anything, it's just on her terms and her terms have been very generous.

5. Ok, fair enough

6. When these crimes are violent, yes, that person should lose his rights to being a parent, especially when those acts were against the pregnant mother of his child. Just like you would want to take a child away from a drug addict mother, no?

All I did was ask for advice on how this situation may play out in the legal system. I have no agenda or blindness because I love this woman. Just looking for some facts is all.
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Re: Rights of a father without joint custody?

Postby newwife » Mon Feb 06, 2012 10:49 am

Ok, I'll admit I stopped reading after the fighting between posters started.
I think you need to ask your lawyer how your judge feels about joint custody.

I live in a pro joint custody state--however--most of the judges only grant joint legal custody should both parents be able to work together. Meaning if one parent said they can not work with/communicate with the other-joint legal would not be granted. However joint physical could be.

Good luck.
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Re: Rights of a father without joint custody?

Postby hoosier_dad » Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:30 pm

15 years ago my ex shared information about abuse in her 1st marriage. I believed every word, she had her story together and I had no doubt that I would be able to spot any false or exaggerated claims from someone I was so close to. I would have vehemently defended her to anyone that spoke otherwise just as the OP is doing in this thread.

Fast forward to 2009 and my ex and ex-MIL are both testifying in court to a specific incident of physical child abuse perpetrated by me on our son. It was a ridiculous claim but they both had their story and facts straight, luckily for me it was countered with coincidental evidence. But I guarantee any casual observer in that courtroom and especially her new Mr Wonderful would agree that I should have lost all custody and been reduced to minimal parenting rights due to their accusations of a physical abuse history.

I also met up with the 1st ex for beers and compared info, and not too surprising it didn't take long to see where her original story unraveled.

I don't think anyone is saying that physical abuse doesn't happen, but we also recognize that false accusations or exaggerated claims of abuse also happen especially in custody or divorce situations. Although we all like to think we could spot the true story from the false one, bottom line unless we were there we really don't know what actually happened.
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Re: Rights of a father without joint custody?

Postby Fatheroffour » Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:44 pm

A Captain cannot be dissuaded of the righteousness of his mission.

Nothing will seep in until the < female genitalia > stops flowing.
Everyone lies.
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