how to get her to move out (or, how can i grow a pair?)

[nevermorenevermore]

here is the nasty background....
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=44957
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=44958

and the cliff notes:
-lost my good paying job 3 months ago.
-STBX SAHM NJ is a "survivor" and attempted suicide 2 months ago. she is in counseling now, but convinced we are not compatible
-she filed 2 weeks ago
-I am a "rescuer" (started w/ me "helping" my NJ mom as a kid) (yeah, i know)
-5 kids (yeah, i know) ages 4 to 10
-in colorado (yeah, i know)
-currently unemployed, prior earnings are in the 80K range.
-getting enough Unemployment to cover basics, mortgage
-own house, im the only one on title/loan. ~200K value, owe 160ish.
-been as*whopped by her for 12 years...

current situation is "amicable", she wants to go back to school and is looking for work. we are basically like platonic roommates. we have a large house (7 bed, 3 bath) and have had no fights/arguments since she filed.

question: financially, we (ok, I) can't afford 2 places. she wants to stay in the house, and i obviously can't leave. I want the house. we are in separate rooms. I want to grow a pair /set a manly example to my kids (punish her for her bad behavior (divorce)) but don't want to hurt the kids. am i being a mangina by letting her stay? or a di*k by kicking her out?

i get 2 different takes on what is best for the kids. NJ=bad for kids is consensus. but she also is their mom, and does a decent job fwiw.

what can i do to get her out of my house? or do i let her live there until my $ changes? things are stable for now, but i can't see this arrangement working post divorce.....and she won't want to leave.... help!


i am following the list (thx), meeting with attorney on monday....

[Fatheroffour]

what can i do to get her out of my house?

Get her a boyfriend.


Unfortunately, it's hard to change the dynamic between you at this point to run her out of the house. She's going to have to want to leave and you trying to force her out is likely to become a pissing contest.

[Chris A]

Since you are the only income I would start controlling the money hard doing all the household shopping and everything. From there the fun can begin.

[BubbaGumpShrimp]

Convince her to move out. Otherwise...you're < edited > outta luck.
That's where I am...the house is in my name, but I'm trying to get NJ out. She had no reason to voluntarily leave. As my name is on everything...it's my job to pay for...everything.

She has to WANT to leave. In my case, I'll likely have to just say f*** it, shut off the utilities, and stop paying for the place. NJ's...lol.

Or just move out (if you want away from her) and figure out the house part later...assuming you have family to go to (what I did).

[coscrewed]

OP, since you indicated you were meeting with an attorney over a week ago, I assume you haven't posted again because you are stunned from being told the level of screw job you are about to face.

I can't emphasize enough how important it is to get full custody of your kids. They don't need to be around a suicidal mother until she is well. Period.

As you now know, the fact that you are unemployed is not as important to the "Family Law" system as the fact that you were the sole breadwinner and were making $80K. Congratulations, you will now be under court order to make *at least* that much for the rest of your life, since your wife is a SAHM with "issues" and you have passed the magic 10 year mark. You are in alimony hell.

If you don't get custody of your kids, you'll be lucky to see 30% of your $80K gross income, assuming you can find a job in this Depression that pays $80K. The rest will go to her in alimony (40%) and CS (probably 30%). If you don't get a job, they will order 100% and you will accrue arrears. The fact that you need money to live doesn't enter into the equation, since obviously, in their eyes, you quit your job on purpose.

Let us know what happens.

[nevermorenevermore]

a quick update

so far, wife is being mostly reasonable, but i expect that to blow up at any moment. we are living together (must, financially at this point) , and I am being super careful to not touch her physically, meet in public etc. so i don't get a spurious order against me.

-keeping my "journal"

-took all 5 kids camping. best 2 days of my life in the past 3 months. For them too.

-I met with an attorney. trying to swallow retainer pill, and worried that this will enact the "nuclear" option of Mutually
Assured Destruction of all assets/family sanity. That I will end up paying for her attorney is the sickest part of this...

-i am seeing a therapist. working on "me"

-wife is willing to move out if I pay her 25K for her half of the house equity. i don't have that kinda dough right now, and can't refinance the house due to credit/current job situation. the 25K is all she wants for "alimony" and i can spread it out according to her. (would love to pay it and move her out...). seems im getting off "easy" if i could get that $ together. and want to make sure she can't come back and ask for more.

-she wants CS, which i am of course willing to pay. AFAIK the number will be low, due to my unemployment (--gut check welcome here--)

-she wants to be "primary" parent. we have agreed in principal to 50/50, but concerns about her mental health and safety of
kids give me ulcers in colorado, there is no need to have a "primary" designated, and I am working to get that language off the agreement.

so, questions:

-should i try to keep this "civil" or go ahead and get an attorney? is it enough i have one ready to go that is briefed on my situation? i don't want things to "blow up" any more than they have.

-am i being fair to my kids that 50/50 is the plan? they need a mom, but they need a well mom. she is in therapy, and hasn't been drinking. or do i go full on and take on 100%? 80%? i am so hurt that I don't think i can be objective about this.

im treading lightly, will keep you all updated. thanks for this resource, and feel free to chime in.....

[BubbaGumpShrimp]

Hire the attorney...now. Do that BEFORE this go down the toilet. I've got to say...once things start to go downhill, it happens fast. Retain the lawyer, continue keeping your journal, and mentally prepare yourself for the nuke that's going to go off sooner or later.

It is interesting that you mention keeping it civil vs. hiring an attorney. That was the issue that set my NJ off. It wasn't that I was telling her I was leaving. In her head, it was all talk until she realized I'd hired an attorney. Again...my situation went down the $h1tter fast.

Keep in mind...regardless of how nice you try to be...if she's going to blow up...she's going to blow up. Nothing you try to do is going to change that. Trying to be nice could come back to bite you in the *** (I won't be shocked when it comes back to bite me in the ***). You can bet that she wouldn't be concerned about your feelings if your roles were reversed.

As the house is in your name and you're the primary caregiver...I think you should go for greater than 50% custody.

[capslock]

...

[Fatheroffour]

so, questions:

-should i try to keep this "civil" or go ahead and get an attorney? is it enough i have one ready to go that is briefed on my situation? i don't want things to "blow up" any more than they have.

-am i being fair to my kids that 50/50 is the plan? they need a mom, but they need a well mom. she is in therapy, and hasn't been drinking. or do i go full on and take on 100%? 80%? i am so hurt that I don't think i can be objective about this.

You seem like a reasonable and nice enough guy. That pushes me to the "Take it all" camp because it is my opinion that the most reasonable and even tempered parent should be the one with all the control. When the reasonable and even tempered one is in control then they are much more apt to be fair, reasonable and equitable with the other parent.

When both fairly equivalent parents are both vying for position and control it's misery for the kids.

[nevermorenevermore]

So, i know you guys all say GET AN ATTORNEY, and believe me, i am trying. I am documenting kid time, being careful to not loose my cool, but it is tough.


so, here's the update:

the "friendly divorce" we had agreed to was me having the kids friday, satruday, sunday, and her having the kids monday-thursday. we agreed to sharing the house, different bedrooms, and me buying her out (eventually)

well, is not so friendly anymore. Wife called me to come home and watch the kids, she had "a meeting." I smelled a rat, but Im trying to be the nice guy here and was glad to get some time with the pre-school age kids. She came back, told me she got an attorney, and demanded I move out. I wouldn't cave. I left mad as all h*ll (i know, risking Restraining Order here, but didn't touch her). I called her later in the day and said I would crash with friends during the week, if she would move out during the weekend. she agreed to that in email yesterday. The purpose here to 1) leave the kids as undisturbed as possible and 2) keep me from loosing my own house.

so, had status conference today. wife showed up with a fat cheep female attorney, which is better than I had (none). I have talked to two attorneys, got some "good luck bro" advice, but literally cannot afford either one right now (2500 retainer posted for one, the other will take payments, but is out of town).

anyway, NJ's attorney confronts me and asks if I will move out. I flatly state no, I will not give up the house. She retorts "So you would rather uproot your children?" What a **** to play my emotions and use my kids as bait. I was so ****d at her, and my NJ to use my kids as a tool. What i thought to say afterwards was that this is the natural consequence my wife has to pay for destroying our family. but i didn't say that.

So, NJ's Attorney said NJ will move out and take the kids with her. I am trying not to shake as I write this, I really feel like they were trying to provoke me. so, here are the q's

1) Is she bluffing?
2) am I being baited to blow up and get a Retraining Order?
3) Can she take the kids? Not sure where she would go, she has no $ either. do I have any say in this?
4) what about parenting time we agreed to in email? is that up in smoke?

Shaking,